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lipsynchell
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2018 6:46 pm

Re: Audio sync issues on Roku TV (TCL 55P607)

Mon Dec 03, 2018 7:21 pm

malrats wrote:
Unfortunately, through a lot of painful testing and trial and error and returned products, as of right now the only way to get rid of the delay is buy a AV Receiver and make sure it does all of the processing instead of the Roku TV. Then the Roku TV apps and all devices attached to both the AVR and TV will be lag-free.

Sadly, this option is for the birds. I just want a simple and clean (and inexpensive!) setup for my small bedroom.

Horrendous situation. Thx, malrats.
No idea what AV Receiver to get and how to set up. Any advice would be much appreciated. How much do they run? Any recommendations?
 
malrats
Posts: 20
Joined: Sat Nov 17, 2018 11:07 pm

Re: Audio sync issues on Roku TV (TCL 55P607)

Mon Dec 03, 2018 8:00 pm

lipsynchell wrote:
malrats wrote:
Unfortunately, through a lot of painful testing and trial and error and returned products, as of right now the only way to get rid of the delay is buy a AV Receiver and make sure it does all of the processing instead of the Roku TV. Then the Roku TV apps and all devices attached to both the AVR and TV will be lag-free.

Sadly, this option is for the birds. I just want a simple and clean (and inexpensive!) setup for my small bedroom.

Horrendous situation. Thx, malrats.
No idea what AV Receiver to get and how to set up. Any advice would be much appreciated. How much do they run? Any recommendations?


I had a lot of success with a Denon AVR-X540BT, but that was on a Black Friday sale for under $300. So now I’d have to recommend a Sony STRDH590 which is only $179.99 right now. Problem with these setups is you need speakers. I had used a pair of Polk bookshelf speakers on sale for $50. That means breaking out a spool of speaker wire...ugh.

Beyond that, you connect the TV to the AVR via HDMI and optical (or you can use just HDMI-ARC but I didn’t test that exact setup) and then you connect each individual device (like game consoles, satellite DVR, etc) via HDMI to the AVR.

It’s actually pretty simple, it’s just bulky and it all takes up so much space and it’s ultimately kinda costly. Although you can get much better sound this way than with a soundbar or little wireless speakers for less money.

I’m no expert on this at all lol but if you have any other questions, I’m here. :)
TCL 55S401 Roku TV (Unsolved audio/video lag issues!)
 
lipsynchell
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2018 6:46 pm

Re: Audio sync issues on Roku TV (TCL 55P607)

Mon Dec 03, 2018 10:27 pm

malrats wrote:
I had a lot of success with a Denon AVR-X540BT, but that was on a Black Friday sale for under $300. So now I’d have to recommend a Sony STRDH590 which is only $179.99 right now. Problem with these setups is you need speakers. I had used a pair of Polk bookshelf speakers on sale for $50. That means breaking out a spool of speaker wire...ugh.

Beyond that, you connect the TV to the AVR via HDMI and optical (or you can use just HDMI-ARC but I didn’t test that exact setup) and then you connect each individual device (like game consoles, satellite DVR, etc) via HDMI to the AVR.

It’s actually pretty simple, it’s just bulky and it all takes up so much space and it’s ultimately kinda costly. Although you can get much better sound this way than with a soundbar or little wireless speakers for less money.

I’m no expert on this at all lol but if you have any other questions, I’m here. :)

Many thanks, malrats!
That is a lot of equipment that I was hoping to avoid with the Roku TV and a Soundbar. Crap, this sucks.
But some good news for those following this thread. I followed the advice of @blade_005 above, and tried playing with the TruVolume On and Off. Didn't seem to make a difference, but then suddenly it seemed like it did something, and worked. I haven't figured out the correct sequence (if that matters), but I was trying turning off/on the Vizio 5.1 soundbar, and also turning on/off the TruVolume. At some point, the audio got synced. Even with Dolby enabled! Now have to hope and pray that it stays that way and does not go off sync repeatedly and soon.
I used this video on YouTube to test. If anyone knows of a better one, please post. With this one, I was basically listening for the beep sound and seeing where the rotating bar is at the point of the beep. With the sync issue, I seem to get anywhere from +2 to +4 delay. Without the sync issue the bar seems to be just between the 0 and +1 when the beep sounds.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s_PbyRpKrRk
 
malrats
Posts: 20
Joined: Sat Nov 17, 2018 11:07 pm

Re: Audio sync issues on Roku TV (TCL 55P607)

Mon Dec 03, 2018 11:16 pm

lipsynchell wrote:
malrats wrote:
I had a lot of success with a Denon AVR-X540BT, but that was on a Black Friday sale for under $300. So now I’d have to recommend a Sony STRDH590 which is only $179.99 right now. Problem with these setups is you need speakers. I had used a pair of Polk bookshelf speakers on sale for $50. That means breaking out a spool of speaker wire...ugh.

Beyond that, you connect the TV to the AVR via HDMI and optical (or you can use just HDMI-ARC but I didn’t test that exact setup) and then you connect each individual device (like game consoles, satellite DVR, etc) via HDMI to the AVR.

It’s actually pretty simple, it’s just bulky and it all takes up so much space and it’s ultimately kinda costly. Although you can get much better sound this way than with a soundbar or little wireless speakers for less money.

I’m no expert on this at all lol but if you have any other questions, I’m here. :)

Many thanks, malrats!
That is a lot of equipment that I was hoping to avoid with the Roku TV and a Soundbar. Crap, this sucks.
But some good news for those following this thread. I followed the advice of @blade_005 above, and tried playing with the TruVolume On and Off. Didn't seem to make a difference, but then suddenly it seemed like it did something, and worked. I haven't figured out the correct sequence (if that matters), but I was trying turning off/on the Vizio 5.1 soundbar, and also turning on/off the TruVolume. At some point, the audio got synced. Even with Dolby enabled! Now have to hope and pray that it stays that way and does not go off sync repeatedly and soon.
I used this video on YouTube to test. If anyone knows of a better one, please post. With this one, I was basically listening for the beep sound and seeing where the rotating bar is at the point of the beep. With the sync issue, I seem to get anywhere from +2 to +4 delay. Without the sync issue the bar seems to be just between the 0 and +1 when the beep sounds.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s_PbyRpKrRk


I always use this video for all of my testing:

https://youtu.be/TjAa0wOe5k4

I really hope that you got your issue all fixed up. I was never able to get what you did going but what I have read from people who did was that after some amount of time spent on the same channel/movie/whatever content, the audio falls back out of sync unless they switch inputs or do whatever trick they had to use to get it in sync.

It’s just such a shame that we have to be in this kind of situation at all. :-/
TCL 55S401 Roku TV (Unsolved audio/video lag issues!)
 
chicagobear
Posts: 3
Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2018 7:39 am

Re: Audio sync issues on Roku TV (TCL 55P607)

Wed Dec 05, 2018 8:57 am

i recently got a 65" tcl 65s4 series roku tv on black friday—couldn't pass up on the deal. i set it up with my directv into one of the hdmi ports and my vizio 5.1 soundbar into the hdmi arc port. there was a very noticeable audio delay which looked like a really bad lip sync. i was really disappointed and thought about returning it after reading all the forums and complaints about this problem. what i finally ended up doing was to plug in my directv output directly into the hdmi in port in the vizio 5.1 soundbar and kept the soundbar plugged into the hdmi arc port on the tv. problem solved! no noticeable delay with the directv! hope that helps...
 
NapMan
Posts: 11
Joined: Wed May 16, 2012 2:51 pm

Re: Audio sync issues on Roku TV (TCL 55P607)

Wed Dec 05, 2018 9:05 am

I ended up buying a new A/V receiver that supports 4K HDR.  So I have my media devices going through the receiver and the delay is gone.
However, if I want to use the built-in Roku that audio does have the delay using an optical cable into the receiver.
 
lipsynchell
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2018 6:46 pm

Re: Audio sync issues on Roku TV (TCL 55P607)

Wed Dec 05, 2018 6:19 pm

chicagobear wrote:
i recently got a 65" tcl 65s4 series roku tv on black friday—couldn't pass up on the deal. i set it up with my directv into one of the hdmi ports and my vizio 5.1 soundbar into the hdmi arc port. there was a very noticeable audio delay which looked like a really bad lip sync. i was really disappointed and thought about returning it after reading all the forums and complaints about this problem. what i finally ended up doing was to plug in my directv output directly into the hdmi in port in the vizio 5.1 soundbar and kept the soundbar plugged into the hdmi arc port on the tv. problem solved! no noticeable delay with the directv! hope that helps...

Am I understanding this right? So both audio and video signals coming in from DirecTV are going into the Vizio Soundbar first and then to the TCL TV through the HDMI-ARC port? Both audio and video?
If I have understood correctly then, I could get a Chromecast, and plug it into the Vizio Soundbar like you have, and be able to stream everything through that and not have any issues! Right?
 
chicagobear
Posts: 3
Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2018 7:39 am

Re: Audio sync issues on Roku TV (TCL 55P607)

Wed Dec 05, 2018 6:29 pm

yeah, that's what's working for me...the hdmi output of my directv box is going directly into the vizio soundbar, so i think the audio goes straight through the soundbar, while the video signal goes out through the hdmi arc port in the vizio soundbar into the tv... 
 
javabits
Posts: 1
Joined: Thu Dec 06, 2018 1:25 pm

Re: Audio sync issues on Roku TV (TCL 55P607)

Thu Dec 06, 2018 1:43 pm

I think I solved this at least for my setup.

TV: TCL 66P607
Soundbar: Vizio 3851D0 connected via HDMI ARC
Plex: Plex Pass (Beta Channel)

Turned off TruVolume on Soundbar.

It looks like what is happening is the Plex Profile is setting the UpperBound for aac audio to 2, but the sound bar can handle 5.1 aac - so when plex streams a video with 5.1 aac it transcodes.

So I tweaked the roku profile (You will need to turn on the debug log to see which profile your setup is using, mines pointed at roku and then if you look at that it points at roku-7.x.xml). Changing the profile directly isn't ideal because I think this might get overwritten with each update. So probably need to look at figuring out how to do this using a client profile. Probably should also back up the original before you make any changes.

Profiles on Windows are located in C:\Program Files (x86)\Plex\Plex Media Server\Resources\Profiles

In the section CodecProfiles I made the following changes to the VideoAudioCodec
changed <VideoAudioCodec name="aac,mp3,mp2,pcm,flac,alac"> to <VideoAudioCodec name="mp3,mp2,pcm,flac,alac">

then after that sections </VideoAudioCodec> I added the following:
<VideoAudioCodec name="aac">
      <Limitations>
        <UpperBound name="audio.channels" value="6" />
        <LowerBound name="audio.samplingRate" value="22050" />
      </Limitations>
    </VideoAudioCodec>

Basically I removed aac from the existing VideoAudioCodec definition which seemed to specify an UpperBound of 2 for audio.channels and then created a new entry for aac.

Now my movies with 5.1 aac direct play to the tcl tv.

If I could only figure out the dts issues now.

semper fi...

gary
 
jfemino
Posts: 1
Joined: Fri Dec 07, 2018 7:52 am

Re: Audio sync issues on Roku TV (TCL 55P607)

Fri Dec 07, 2018 7:57 am

I purchased a 55 TCL Roku tv and had had similar issues with audio synch.  I tried a lot of suggestions for software changes and came up with a simple solution.  I purchased an inexpensive digital audio converter and connected it to the digital audio out - the DCA converted it to analog audio with RCA jacks and connected to audio in on my old analog receiver. Works great. 
 
blade_005
Posts: 153
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:47 am
Location: USA

Re: Audio sync issues on Roku TV (TCL 55P607)

Fri Dec 07, 2018 9:52 am

lipsynchell wrote:
malrats wrote:
I had a lot of success with a Denon AVR-X540BT, but that was on a Black Friday sale for under $300. So now I’d have to recommend a Sony STRDH590 which is only $179.99 right now. Problem with these setups is you need speakers. I had used a pair of Polk bookshelf speakers on sale for $50. That means breaking out a spool of speaker wire...ugh.

Beyond that, you connect the TV to the AVR via HDMI and optical (or you can use just HDMI-ARC but I didn’t test that exact setup) and then you connect each individual device (like game consoles, satellite DVR, etc) via HDMI to the AVR.

It’s actually pretty simple, it’s just bulky and it all takes up so much space and it’s ultimately kinda costly. Although you can get much better sound this way than with a soundbar or little wireless speakers for less money.

I’m no expert on this at all lol but if you have any other questions, I’m here. :)

Many thanks, malrats!
That is a lot of equipment that I was hoping to avoid with the Roku TV and a Soundbar. Crap, this sucks.
But some good news for those following this thread. I followed the advice of @blade_005 above, and tried playing with the TruVolume On and Off. Didn't seem to make a difference, but then suddenly it seemed like it did something, and worked. I haven't figured out the correct sequence (if that matters), but I was trying turning off/on the Vizio 5.1 soundbar, and also turning on/off the TruVolume. At some point, the audio got synced. Even with Dolby enabled! Now have to hope and pray that it stays that way and does not go off sync repeatedly and soon.
I used this video on YouTube to test. If anyone knows of a better one, please post. With this one, I was basically listening for the beep sound and seeing where the rotating bar is at the point of the beep. With the sync issue, I seem to get anywhere from +2 to +4 delay. Without the sync issue the bar seems to be just between the 0 and +1 when the beep sounds.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s_PbyRpKrRk

Glad you have had some success. I turned off TruVolume, changed my Sound mode from MOVIE to DIRECT and adjusted AUDIO DELAY setting on Vizio SB thru SmartCast app from 0 to 2. I did the TruVolume ON and OFF toggle initially and would see it synch back up, but inevitably it would drift again. I have not had much delay with 5.1 audio recently with my configuration. When I do, I find a quick fix is to turn my Vizio SB off and let it default back to the TV Speakers and 2.0 Stereo and the audio drift is gone. I turn my Vizio SB back on and it picks up stream and the 5.1 audio is back in synch. This normally fixes the issue and I don't see it again for the current stream.
TCL Roku 55P605 | VIZIO SmartCast SB3651‑E6 Soundbar
TCL Roku 32S301
 
chicagobear
Posts: 3
Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2018 7:39 am

Re: Audio sync issues on Roku TV (TCL 55P607)

Mon Dec 10, 2018 5:57 pm

chicagobear wrote:
i recently got a 65" tcl 65s4 series roku tv on black friday—couldn't pass up on the deal. i set it up with my directv into one of the hdmi ports and my vizio 5.1 soundbar into the hdmi arc port. there was a very noticeable audio delay which looked like a really bad lip sync. i was really disappointed and thought about returning it after reading all the forums and complaints about this problem. what i finally ended up doing was to plug in my directv output directly into the hdmi in port in the vizio 5.1 soundbar and kept the soundbar plugged into the hdmi arc port on the tv. problem solved! no noticeable delay with the directv! hope that helps...

although i was able to get my directv to sync by going directly into the soundbar, my new problem is that my blu-ray player, which goes into the tv, has a noticeable audio delay. i only have one hdmi input port into the soundbar, so either i have to keep switching the inputs between the directv and blu-ray, or buy an hdmi switch...neither is ideal because then i can no longer select my inputs via the remote...oh well...
 
lipsynchell
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2018 6:46 pm

Re: Audio sync issues on Roku TV (TCL 55P607)

Tue Dec 11, 2018 12:54 am

chicagobear wrote:
chicagobear wrote:
i recently got a 65" tcl 65s4 series roku tv on black friday—couldn't pass up on the deal. i set it up with my directv into one of the hdmi ports and my vizio 5.1 soundbar into the hdmi arc port. there was a very noticeable audio delay which looked like a really bad lip sync. i was really disappointed and thought about returning it after reading all the forums and complaints about this problem. what i finally ended up doing was to plug in my directv output directly into the hdmi in port in the vizio 5.1 soundbar and kept the soundbar plugged into the hdmi arc port on the tv. problem solved! no noticeable delay with the directv! hope that helps...

although i was able to get my directv to sync by going directly into the soundbar, my new problem is that my blu-ray player, which goes into the tv, has a noticeable audio delay. i only have one hdmi input port into the soundbar, so either i have to keep switching the inputs between the directv and blu-ray, or buy an hdmi switch...neither is ideal because then i can no longer select my inputs via the remote...oh well...

I've been playing around with settings, and am beginning to feel that this is a complex problem caused by many aspects involved - the quality of the encoded stream, the app (Roku channel), Roku itself, the software encoding/decoding by the Soundbar / AV Receiver...
Nevertheless, I have found that setting the AV Delay on Vizio Soundbar (using their SmartCast Mobile app on my phone) seems to solve the problem for significant amounts of time. I had to set the value all the way up to 4 for the audio to be synced with lip movements. Actually feel that it needs between 3 and 4, but can't do fractional values. @chicagobear, you may want to give this a try. I also set the Sound properties for S/PDIF/ARC to Dolby DTS. Not the Dolby DTS+.

Also, I find that the stream on the ABC News Roku channel is very well synced. Don't see any lipsync issues on there. Horrible with Xfinity channel.

btw, watched the Bears beat the Rams with roars coming through the Soundbar :).
 
TiggerSr
Posts: 2
Joined: Thu Dec 13, 2018 10:36 am

Re: Audio sync issues on Roku TV (TCL 55P607)

Thu Dec 13, 2018 10:44 am

danep wrote:
I just confirmed that watching Netflix 5.1 content on the Streaming Stick connected to my AVR works fine. If anything, the audio might be slightly ahead of the video (opposite of the problem I had watching 5.1 content directly from the Roku TV).

You had me scared for a minute though. The way I used to test audio sync on the Roku TV was by watching "lip sync" test videos on Youtube. The Roku TV would output these in 5.1 audio even though the clips themselves were only stereo.

I was testing the same way with the Streaming Stick until today, when your comment made me realize that apparently Youtube on the streaming stick doesn't support 5.1 audio at all, it only outputs stereo PCM. That's somewhat disappointing, and it makes this problem much harder to test.

Anyway: all of this lends further evidence to my theory about what's happening here, that it's a fundamental problem with the idea of a TV playing 5.1 encoded content. There is some inherent delay (~200ms) in decoding DTS / Dolby bitstreams. Traditionally this hasn't been a problem because an external device generates the audio and video streams and sends them both to a TV or AVR via HDMI. The TV or AVR knows how much the audio stream will be delayed by this processing, so it can delay the video stream by an equivalent amount to keep the two in sync.

With these new Roku TVs that play content themselves (instead of from an external device), this paradigm isn't sustainable. The TV playing the video component of the stream has no idea how much of a delay will be introduced by the downstream AVR, so there's no way it could possibly compensate by delaying the video stream. This will simply never work, unless HDMI ARC has some sort of provision to return the AVR's internal audio delay back to the TV.

If this is the problem, then why do I not have the problem when watching Netflix streams through Roku?
 
malrats
Posts: 20
Joined: Sat Nov 17, 2018 11:07 pm

Re: Audio sync issues on Roku TV (TCL 55P607)

Thu Dec 13, 2018 1:01 pm

TiggerSr wrote:
danep wrote:
I just confirmed that watching Netflix 5.1 content on the Streaming Stick connected to my AVR works fine. If anything, the audio might be slightly ahead of the video (opposite of the problem I had watching 5.1 content directly from the Roku TV).

You had me scared for a minute though. The way I used to test audio sync on the Roku TV was by watching "lip sync" test videos on Youtube. The Roku TV would output these in 5.1 audio even though the clips themselves were only stereo.

I was testing the same way with the Streaming Stick until today, when your comment made me realize that apparently Youtube on the streaming stick doesn't support 5.1 audio at all, it only outputs stereo PCM. That's somewhat disappointing, and it makes this problem much harder to test.

Anyway: all of this lends further evidence to my theory about what's happening here, that it's a fundamental problem with the idea of a TV playing 5.1 encoded content. There is some inherent delay (~200ms) in decoding DTS / Dolby bitstreams. Traditionally this hasn't been a problem because an external device generates the audio and video streams and sends them both to a TV or AVR via HDMI. The TV or AVR knows how much the audio stream will be delayed by this processing, so it can delay the video stream by an equivalent amount to keep the two in sync.

With these new Roku TVs that play content themselves (instead of from an external device), this paradigm isn't sustainable. The TV playing the video component of the stream has no idea how much of a delay will be introduced by the downstream AVR, so there's no way it could possibly compensate by delaying the video stream. This will simply never work, unless HDMI ARC has some sort of provision to return the AVR's internal audio delay back to the TV.

If this is the problem, then why do I not have the problem when watching Netflix streams through Roku?


This is definitely on the right track. I just wonder why it USED to work just fine (1-2 months ago) before a firmware update.
TCL 55S401 Roku TV (Unsolved audio/video lag issues!)

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