Your Digital Media Has Never Looked So Good

 
robertm
Posts: 2665
Joined: Mon Oct 26, 2009 3:06 pm

Re: Food For Thought, Cord Cutters

Wed Feb 16, 2011 12:50 pm

stratcat96 wrote:
West Ham wrote:

So how do you explain music sales declining by 55% in the past ten years?


Remember there are many more revenue streams in the music industry than just sales of cds/mp3s



I think the bombardment of options lends a hand. Satellite radios, music channels on cable and satellite, and internet radio making owning content less and less necessary. I have thousands of dollars tied up in my music collection and I find myself using pandora all the time. I get a random mix of my favorites and I get songs that I like but not enough that I want to hear them on a regular basis from my Ipod.
 
tekpedia
Posts: 13
Joined: Thu Dec 23, 2010 3:51 pm

Re: Food For Thought, Cord Cutters

Wed Feb 16, 2011 6:44 pm

mike_b wrote:
jcmolet wrote:
"When I turn on my TV I never have to wonder what the quality will be or if I can find the show in HD. The fact is TV is convenient, it always works and that's why so many people pay for the service each month. The same can't be said for over-the-top services and other forms of online content."

I certainly agree with this quote. The quality and convenience is great with cable TV. However, the value was not there for me because I only watched a few of the channels. Much of the programming seemed like junk. This made me feel like I was wasting my money when I paid the cable bill. I'm happier without cable TV.


I think what the cable and sat. companies are not hearing is that most of us would keep our cable if they had al-a-carte programing. This is what you get via the net, You get to watch what you want (for the most part) when you want. Plus, many of us are tired of being held hostage where someone else decides what channels I will get. If it wasn't getting popular you wouldn't see all of the different podcasts on the subject or the rash of set-top boxes hit the market.
 
mommom
Posts: 971
Joined: Sat Jan 08, 2011 9:21 am

Re: Food For Thought, Cord Cutters

Wed Feb 16, 2011 7:05 pm

"Cable TV and cable internet both arrive to your home via one cable. Once in your house, the cable can be split and sent to different rooms to connect to TV's and and a modem."

So if everyone switched to streaming and cable wiring did not have to carry the tv signal,does that have an impact on the quality of the service,or the cost of the infrastructure,licensing,etc on their end?Like,if they were not providing cable,and we all streamed alacarte,we would pay our own subscriptions.So they would not have that expense,or the expense of planning,the satillite services,some technicians,maybe even all of their office personnel?If we suddenly lived in the modern world where we were all connected the cable company could concentrate on their infrastructure for the internet,the phone companies could and are working to do the same(Fios,etc).Their expenses might go down considerably?Then the networks,or aggregating companies like Hulu would charge a fee for what we want-say Hulu could offer tiered packages of service just like cable for those who want it,even a set top box for those who are not able to handle the PC to TV thing.Roku could make a Rulu for them.

Would or could any of this happen?

I obviously have no understanding of servers,etc and how or who would be carrying that expense and service.
 
vmps
Posts: 758
Joined: Sun Jan 18, 2009 7:48 am

Re: Food For Thought, Cord Cutters

Thu Feb 17, 2011 6:26 am

robertm wrote:
You should really have read my posts more thoroughly. I never said the internet won't catch up I just said it can't handle 120 millions streaming customers currently.


of course it can't: what kind of idiot (soon out of business) company would build out one or two orders of magnitude of unused capacity? people are using X, they provision X + Y% overhead. as X grows, so does the amount of bandwidth provisioned. Y is generally not going to be more than 100%.
 
vmps
Posts: 758
Joined: Sun Jan 18, 2009 7:48 am

Re: Food For Thought, Cord Cutters

Thu Feb 17, 2011 6:35 am

robertm wrote:
Actually this entire tangent was created by VMPS who had to challenge my comment about entertainment being increasingly more expensive. I am not the one trying desperately to win this debate. I find it sort of funny how passionate people are about this subject. I made 3 base comments:


You made three inane comments, and I have NO IDEA why you're even having this debate. From someone who claims not to care, you seem dead set on trying to scare people into continuing to pay for cable.


Are any of them false? My point was and is until we know how number 2 will be handled is it a good idea to actively encourage cord cutting


This is the kind of inanity I'm talking about. "OH NO, don't talk about cutting the cord because maybe it will be bad. I'm saying it will be but WE JUST DON'T KNOW. Do you want to take that kind of risk? You could personally be responsible for killing TV shows!" My position is "I'll tell people my experience, tell them I'm perfectly happy not paying a cable bill. If they want to keep paying, why should I care." Your position seems to be "Keep paying your cable bill to subsidize my TV shows without me having to see anything change, because change is scary and bad." Umm, ok.
 
HeyJoe
Posts: 44
Joined: Tue Feb 08, 2011 9:06 am
Location: New York

Re: Food For Thought, Cord Cutters

Thu Feb 17, 2011 7:42 am

I wish I could completely dump cable/satellite, but unfortunately I live in an area where not even a digital antenna would work.

My satellite bill is now through the roof and that is how I stumbled on the Roku box. Lots of reading on the subject. I know I am getting rid of my current provider, but I am just trying to find a deal that I can live with/afford. The thing for me is, I like getting PPV boxing matches, but the local cable people told me I can't buy them unless I have a converter box and a package that's more than basic cable, aka more money. I did want just basic service, it's only $16 a month. So I'm stuck, in a way.

I may have to go for someone with another promo deal. Too bad, really. As far as Roku, though, it's staying here. At least I won't have to pay for those stupid "premium" pay movie channels that relentlessly play the same thing month after month. Netflix is working out nicely.

Btw, I just finished reading an article about this subject. The sat/cab companies, of course, are downplaying the "cord cutting".

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110216/ap_ ... cable_tv_3
 
krisbee
Posts: 1065
Joined: Wed Nov 24, 2010 12:09 pm

Re: Food For Thought, Cord Cutters

Thu Feb 17, 2011 8:21 am

I had a whole reply that disappeared.. Oh well... short version.

Most people I know mainly watch OTA programming - well, that will still be available regardless of streaming. It might be in the future that the cell phone companies will stream this material for all as well (really only five networks here).

Most of us here are TV watchers - that's why we bought ourselves this toy and was pleasantly surprised at how effective it really is. The DVR changed how we watch TV (as did the VCR, but I think more so in HOW we watch TV). I watch more TV now in less time - especially since most TV is filled filler (coming up on, previously on, recaps, preview, etc.) Heck sometimes American Idol on the result show is shortened in this household to 5 minutes! :)

If you think about all the programming you pay extra for on cable/satellite, there is lots of cross pollenization. The Discovery/TLC/History/DIY/HGTV/Food/MTV/VH1 networks probably only put on 3 hours of programming a day - the rest is either repeated, chopped and recut, old stuff, or even shows from its' sister networks that show up on it. The Science Channel is almost all Discovery shows recut from the past, and some of the other stuff is shows from Canada. When you narrow it down, some of these channels are less than a $1 per household for the satellite/cable companies - so what value are you REALLY getting?

I would hope in the future some of these shows would just be the new material - I would much rather watch a 15 minute reality show without filler than an hour one - and since you aren't subject to marketing/ratings with lead-ins and time slots that destroy otherwise good shows that monkey with its' position and audience - I think we might get better programming. Shows in England run real short sometimes - they explore their premise and end it. The Young Ones - groundbreaking an hilarious - 12 episodes (or something like that). Fawlty Towers, The Office, Spaced, etc. They don't beat the dead horse over there nearly as much. If we didn't have a grid system on TV and actually had choice to what we want to watch WHEN we do - I think our entertainment landscape would change drastically. You wouldn't have to worry about when 18-35 yr olds are watching - they are watching whenever they want! Same thing for a show that has a more mature content (sexual or otherwise)... it can just be out there and not stuck to after 10pm.

I think the Roku (and its' competitors) could really change the face of media - and in a good way. Traditional TV could still be out there, but it would be tied into a DVR and the internet streaming box. Most of your big budget stuff still on the major networks - your other shows could be out there in cyberspace.

As for the network bandwith issue - stop getting tied up with technology - new technology is always being developed to solve a need. That's how the wheel got invented. Crap, 10 years ago who would think we would have full web and application access via a phone. 10 years before that, texting and email via cell phone - let alone a digital connection would have be stuff to dream about.

Even 20 years ago, you would have had to have a university and a text terminal for us to debate this crap like we are, and 10 years ago, video on the internet at all would have been abysmal at best.
 
MikeDevenney
Posts: 1
Joined: Thu Feb 17, 2011 10:14 am

Re: Food For Thought, Cord Cutters

Thu Feb 17, 2011 10:21 am

hn333 wrote:
stratcat96 wrote:
what you are missing though, is the same people that are cutting cable out completely are the ones who can't afford to run out and buy multiple xboxes, ps3s, BD players, and multiple Apple TV's. I'm not trying to get personal but I do think that economic strata skewes the objectivity of some... Not many people sit around and say "Gee, it'd be fun to save some money". They do sit around and go "I don't have enough money to afford all this anymore, where am I going to cut.." That's why people are dropping cable.


True, it's not like we need Cable TV. Maybe people will start reading books again.


That would be nice, but not very likely. More likely is that they will pick up their (nook, iPad, Kindle, android phone, iPhone or insert favorite reader here) and pull down a new "book". Sadly, I think printed books are going the way of Cable TV.
 
HeyJoe
Posts: 44
Joined: Tue Feb 08, 2011 9:06 am
Location: New York

Re: Food For Thought, Cord Cutters

Thu Feb 17, 2011 11:10 am

MikeDevenney wrote:
Sadly, I think printed books are going the way of Cable TV.


People don't/can't read anymore. Our library's rate of books borrowing vs. videos borrowing is roughly 25% to 75%. It gets more new movies than books. I'll try to borrow a new book. They never have it. A new video release? They always have it and it's always out. At the checkout I'll see people with as many videos as they can carry, no books at all. What a shame.

Plus, Borders filing for chapter 11 and closing 200 of its 488 stores. 6,000 people losing their jobs. The Borders near us is on that hit list.
 
stratcat96
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Re: Food For Thought, Cord Cutters

Thu Feb 17, 2011 11:27 am

HeyJoe wrote:
MikeDevenney wrote:
Sadly, I think printed books are going the way of Cable TV.


People don't/can't read anymore. Our library's rate of books borrowing vs. videos borrowing is roughly 25% to 75%. It gets more new movies than books. I'll try to borrow a new book. They never have it. A new video release? They always have it and it's always out. At the checkout I'll see people with as many videos as they can carry, no books at all. What a shame.

Plus, Borders filing for chapter 11 and closing 200 of its 488 stores. 6,000 people losing their jobs. The Borders near us is on that hit list.



Borders has been on its way out for awhile. Because of the internet, traditional book pricing and profit margins have gone outt he window due to used book marketplaces and increased competition on a large scale, and ebooks to an extent. They can no longer make the profit margins they used to because of this, and without diversifying and morphing their business model their margins aren't enough to keep brick and mortars doors open. They made the right move.


The whole industry is changing, just like the music industry did and the movie industry is. People still read, the channels from which they get their materials are what's changing.
Last edited by stratcat96 on Thu Feb 17, 2011 11:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
robertm
Posts: 2665
Joined: Mon Oct 26, 2009 3:06 pm

Re: Food For Thought, Cord Cutters

Thu Feb 17, 2011 11:31 am

vmps wrote:
robertm wrote:
Actually this entire tangent was created by VMPS who had to challenge my comment about entertainment being increasingly more expensive. I am not the one trying desperately to win this debate. I find it sort of funny how passionate people are about this subject. I made 3 base comments:


You made three inane comments, and I have NO IDEA why you're even having this debate. From someone who claims not to care, you seem dead set on trying to scare people into continuing to pay for cable.


Are any of them false? My point was and is until we know how number 2 will be handled is it a good idea to actively encourage cord cutting


This is the kind of inanity I'm talking about. "OH NO, don't talk about cutting the cord because maybe it will be bad. I'm saying it will be but WE JUST DON'T KNOW. Do you want to take that kind of risk? You could personally be responsible for killing TV shows!" My position is "I'll tell people my experience, tell them I'm perfectly happy not paying a cable bill. If they want to keep paying, why should I care." Your position seems to be "Keep paying your cable bill to subsidize my TV shows without me having to see anything change, because change is scary and bad." Umm, ok.



LOL. Of the two of us you are clearly the most worked up over this issue. Not everything new will be good and not everything old was evil. Tell me how much good has come from demanding cheaper products and services over the last 30-40 years? Good honest jobs have been exported, the TV shop owner is all but extinct, and half the crap in our homes was made in China.

You want to paint me as preaching doom and gloom but all I am really saying is shouldn't we see how they will pay for new original content before grabbing our friends and neighbors and serving them the kool-aide? If someone wants to cut the cord they will and have but I am not going to encourage anyone to do it because my biggest fear is going back to commercial flower.

Right now we are in the sweet spot. Streaming is growing more popular and offering more options and DVRs are on alert 24 hours a day for all of our favorite programs to then provide us with commercial-free entertainment.
 
krisbee
Posts: 1065
Joined: Wed Nov 24, 2010 12:09 pm

Re: Food For Thought, Cord Cutters

Thu Feb 17, 2011 11:31 am

People don't/can't read anymore.


This is nonsense. People are reading all the time - you are doing it right now. Printed word is dead, but everyone is on the internet reading. Just because your idea of what reading is hasn't changed doesn't mean the world hasn't changed.

You can debate the quality of the material, and the level of comprehension and I am with you - grammar and spelling have diminished and people's appreciation for language is certainly not what is was - but I would venture children are reading MORE than they ever have. Those Harry Potter and Twilight books are dense! However, you might say Dickens has more intrinsic value (it doesn't, really). The amount people read hasn't changed - the vessel and content has.

Kids are texting and emailing at a VERY young age - if you added up how many words they have communicated with each other up to age 18, it is certainly more than children of the 60's-90's did. Of course they can't spell or write a proper sentence, but that isn't the point.

As for borrowing books - with local budget cuts is it any wonder? I read quite a bit - nonfiction mostly, but I usually buy used books on amazon for $2-$5 opposed to going to my local library... It would cost me that in gas!
 
HeyJoe
Posts: 44
Joined: Tue Feb 08, 2011 9:06 am
Location: New York

Re: Food For Thought, Cord Cutters

Thu Feb 17, 2011 11:56 am

Thank you for letting me know that an opinion that I have is nonsense. Of course, not everyone has abandoned reading. I was simply speaking in general terms. But the fact remains that reading snippets doesn't really constitute reading, in my opinion, which is, of course, nonsense. And if that makes me oblivious to what constitutes reading and how it has changed, that's okay, I stand convicted.

And, also, the fact remains that my own library president informed us of the sad state of borrowing videos vs books. People would simply rather look at something than read and use their minds and imagination. Not everyone, of course, but far too many.

“It doesn’t matter how good or bad the product is, the fact is that people don’t read anymore. Forty percent of the people in the U.S. read one book or less last year.” - Steve Jobs
 
robertm
Posts: 2665
Joined: Mon Oct 26, 2009 3:06 pm

Re: Food For Thought, Cord Cutters

Thu Feb 17, 2011 12:17 pm

krisbee wrote:
If you think about all the programming you pay extra for on cable/satellite, there is lots of cross pollenization. The Discovery/TLC/History/DIY/HGTV/Food/MTV/VH1 networks probably only put on 3 hours of programming a day - the rest is either repeated, chopped and recut, old stuff, or even shows from its' sister networks that show up on it. The Science Channel is almost all Discovery shows recut from the past, and some of the other stuff is shows from Canada. When you narrow it down, some of these channels are less than a $1 per household for the satellite/cable companies - so what value are you REALLY getting?



If I could cut MTV, which I haven't watched easily in 10 years I would. Of the ones you named it is the most expensive channel I never use. The science channel I use enough for it to warrant the 10 cents or so it cost me per month.

The thing is I don't think of my TV experience as a per channel deal anymore. The only time I watch live TV is sports and news. I would find it difficult to tell you what day, channel, or time that my shows run. I know Eureka is on the SyFy channel and it runs in the summer but I have no idea what day or time my DVR records it. I know the Office is recorded sometime around nine on Thursday night but I don't know what channel it comes on.

The way I see it, I pay a monthly amount and whenever I sit down to watch TV I have plenty of things to watch. It is also super easy to manage. Every weekend I run 3 searches. It searches the description of every show in the guide for "Pilot series", "Season Premier", and then "Series Premier." Pilot gets me most new things and most anything old that is starting over, series gets me all the true pilots (some of them do not contain the word pilot) and I record as many of those that look even partially interesting, and season gets me anything restarting that either may not be already being recorded or has a name change each year like survivor for instance. The whole process takes a couple of minutes and I don't have to consult a computer unless I am trying to figure out if a show has been cancelled and the timer needs to be removed.

Now because of external hard drives I can keep all of the shows I know I will want to watch again for as long as I want. I probably have about 30 seasons of various TV shows on my USB drives. This will keep me from ever having to purchase that content from itunes or Amazon so some of my satellite bill is offset.
 
vmps
Posts: 758
Joined: Sun Jan 18, 2009 7:48 am

Re: Food For Thought, Cord Cutters

Thu Feb 17, 2011 12:30 pm

robertm wrote:
You want to paint me as preaching doom and gloom but all I am really saying is shouldn't we see how they will pay for new original content before grabbing our friends and neighbors and serving them the kool-aide?


I give up, you're right. I will immediately start lying to my friends and family and tell them that they absolutely must pay a cable bill, that I have not cut my cable, and that I couldn't possibly live without cable. I don't mind lying about my experiences to please you. Happy? Good, let's kill the thread.

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