Your Digital Media Has Never Looked So Good

 
mommom
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Channel developers

Wed Jun 29, 2011 6:37 pm

I just have to say that maybe in the future when someone goes to the trouble of building a channel for the Roku ,if it has issues or problems that we feel strongly about,maybe we should speak privately in PM's or use the channels own forum or emails,etc to complain,instead of castigating the developer in public.Right or wrong,legal or not or some shade of gray,the developers have made a huge effort to provide the channel.Internet streaming is still young,so are the whys and wherefores of watching,providing,cloud computing etc.Its kind of on training wheels,mistakes and missteps will happen.I would sure hate for any developer to shy away from Roku for fear of making a mistake and being called a criminal.Thats all I want to say,I am not getting into :) or promoting some argument or discussion,I just think we can do better.
 
stratcat96
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Re: Channel developers

Wed Jun 29, 2011 6:40 pm

usually the ppl that castigate these developers have a burr in their saddle already and relish in making noise...
 
destruk
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Re: Channel developers

Wed Jun 29, 2011 6:43 pm

I don't think anyone knew they could stream illegal cam movie files like Cars 2, on said channel, in previous alpha copies. In that case, how could anyone have known until they saw it for themselves? I would think the developers themselves would have noticed - and if they did, why would they be distributing copies of illegal content unless they were asking to be fried over an open flame?
 
smlsr
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Re: Channel developers

Wed Jun 29, 2011 7:02 pm

No worries guys. NokNok is will adapt the ROKU channel to be in line with ROKU's developer agreement and all should be good.

DLNA will be released tonite to current testers as well, so ROKU devices will have the ability to work with almost any DLNA server, as well as our LINK server being released next week.

If it were easy, wouldnt be worth much.
 
destruk
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Re: Channel developers

Wed Jun 29, 2011 10:14 pm

While you fix the Roku channel to fit in with the DMCA, you might want to consider doing the same for your other distributed applications before the MPAA notices.
 
smlsr
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Re: Channel developers

Wed Jun 29, 2011 10:18 pm

destruk wrote:
While you fix the Roku channel to fit in with the DMCA, you might want to consider doing the same for your other distributed applications before the MPAA notices.


DMCA changes?

I think you misread...DLNA
 
destruk
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Re: Channel developers

Thu Jun 30, 2011 5:00 am

Digital Millenium Copyright Act - you know, the law? Don't worry, I'm sure people have already notified the proper authorities and hopefully they will contact you sooner rather than later.
- edited - anyway, I always said if someone was using a tool to find illegal stuff on the internet, enforcement agencies would be smart to use the same tool, which could be why so many of your parsed programs don't exist very long and you have to update them four times per day to keep up with the bloodhounds.
 
mastermesh
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Re: Channel developers

Thu Jun 30, 2011 6:04 am

Digital Millenium Copyright Act - you know, the law? Don't worry, I'm sure people have already notified the proper authorities and hopefully they will contact you sooner rather than later.
I'm still waiting for any of the other channel creators who are showing shows from nbc, cbs, and other places to upload a dually signed copy of the contracts they have with those content creators. I highly suspect we'll see no signature pages anytime soon ...

for those that have no idea what I'm talking about...

Here it is (which I've not really plainly written out here in the forums til now):
If you are a channel creator, I challenge you to upload a copy of the dually signed contract signature page for the contract you have with content creators for the content you are showing in your roku channel so that all your viewers can see that you are legally distributing the stuff you are distributing with permission from the copyright owners. No need to show the whole contract, since there may be trade secrets and stuff in there, and nda stuff - just a copy of the page that shows your signature and the signature of the content creators for the content you are showing to us through the roku. If you do upload those pages, please post a link to them here in a reply to this thread so they'll all be in one place, easily accessed. Thanks.

--- edit ---
Honestly, I don't really care one way or the other personally about this stuff, but obviously some do. I believe in the right to free speech, and that information seeks to be be 'free' but I also can see the content creator's side of things as I'm an artist myself.

Technically, just to view any website you are creating a copy of the copyrighted images and stuff on that site, or actually, your browser is... which makes the entire internet a copyright violation if you want to get right down to the nitty gritty of it, lol.

I do know that some podcasts and stuff don't require written permission, but if you folks that are creating the channels can show proof of that you are not in violation of copyrights, etc., why not go ahead and show it up front so that you can explain to both your viewers and the content creators why you have the 'right' to distribute what you are distributing, and won't get some cease and desist letters or crazy viewers creating all sorts of hate mail directed at you.

I honestly think if the stuff's on the internet, and the roku can be made to view it, why not let folks view it... They are likely to do so anyways, just using something other than a roku to do so. Heck, pirated stuff actually probably causes more money to roll in to the content creators indirectly... if someone likes a movie enough they will buy it. If someone wants to see higher quality movies, they'll get a subscription to netflix, etc.
Last edited by mastermesh on Thu Jun 30, 2011 7:24 am, edited 2 times in total.
http://forums.roku.com/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=46566&p=359897#p359897 -channel lists/tools
http://forums.roku.com/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=63553&p=409506#p409506 -fta
http://forums.roku.com/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=64096 -linear channels
 
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gonzotek
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Re: Channel developers

Thu Jun 30, 2011 6:47 am

mastermesh wrote:
Here it is (which I've not really plainly written out here in the forums til now):
If you are a channel creator, I challenge you to upload a copy of the dually signed contract you have with content creators for the content you are showing in your roku channel so that all your viewers can see that you are legally distributing the stuff you are distributing with permission from the copyright owners. No need to show the whole contract, since there may be trade secrets and stuff in there, and nda stuff - just a copy of the page that shows your signature and the signature of the content creators for the content you are showing to us through the roku. If you do upload those pages, please post a link to them here in a reply to this thread so they'll all be in one place, easily accessed. Thanks.
You're obviously free to ask for evidence of a contract between a channel developer and a content owner, but such a contract may not in fact exist. That doesn't immediately make the channel developer guilty of copyright infringement. I'm on the side of not enabling the breaking of copyright, but you(and other users) should be aware that not all content owners require that you sign any legally binding documents in order to use their content. For instance, any content which is licensed with a creative commons attribution-share-alike license is fair game for developers to incorporate into their channels, with the provision that they properly attribute the content to the owner. Many podcasts are also be freely distributed with a license compatible with Roku-style usage. For instance here is the FAQ for the msnbc podcasts, including terms of service: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/38001458/t/ ... -msnbccom/ . CNN provides similar terms.

The DMCA doesn't require providers to post the details of contracts they may have with content owners. It requires providers to remove access to copyrighted content if requested by the owner. Roku abides by the DMCA, as spelled out in their developer agreement. Youtube has a page with some of the DMCA takedown requirements boiled down to a digestible essense:
http://www.youtube.com/t/dmca_policy

Finally, do I think that providing access to movies which are still in theaters should be allowable? Simply, and clearly no. Roku doesn't appear to want a reputation as a piracy device, and I respect them for that. I also respect their desire to take a hands-off approach while abiding by the terms of the DMCA. I feel it is a fair balance between the users' desire to see what is interesting to them and the content owners' rights to dictate the terms of use of their intellectual property.
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stratcat96
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Re: Channel developers

Thu Jun 30, 2011 6:50 am

since when did everybody come out of the woodwork to be whistle blowers for the TV networks and movie studios?
 
jaemlllz
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Re: Channel developers

Thu Jun 30, 2011 7:38 am

F! Those movie studios and networks! They make millions of dollars per episode and movie. Let noknok live! Roku already sucks with all its crappy apps/channel. There is no real content on there besides hulu and netflix. Noknok was a breath of fresh air. get a life snitches!
 
-LD
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Re: Channel developers

Thu Jun 30, 2011 7:43 am

Netflix, Hulu, Crackle, Amazon, Pandora, NHL, UFC, NBA...yeah, not much out there.

Studios don't actually make millions per episode. They lose money on many movies and shows. Overall I don't think they even keep up with the growth of the stock market.
 
jaemlllz
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Re: Channel developers

Thu Jun 30, 2011 8:14 am

-LD wrote:
Netflix, Hulu, Crackle, Amazon, Pandora, NHL, UFC, NBA...yeah, not much out there.

Studios don't actually make millions per episode. They lose money on many movies and shows. Overall I don't think they even keep up with the growth of the stock market.


Who actually watch nhl? And the nba is seasonal and the quality is actually choppy. Amazon and hulu has basically the same library that netflix has. So you really get nothing extra for your money. Lets be serious now. Your paying for all those channels when they all carry the same thing netflix carries? And if you believe these networks and studios are not making millions and are living lavish life styles then you need to open your eyes. especially these days where they make money from cable networks for showing there movies and internet sites like hulu, and netflix and blockbuster and redbox and so on and so on..... lets be serious kid.
Last edited by jaemlllz on Thu Jun 30, 2011 8:26 am, edited 2 times in total.
 
mommom
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Re: Channel developers

Thu Jun 30, 2011 8:20 am

From what I have been reading about the DMCA,if a website,channel or device mfg starts removing content on their own because they believe it violates DMCA,they then become liable for any pirated content on their site,channel or device.The law simply states that content owners must police their own content and send notices of take down.The sites,channels,etc must then remove the content.If they allow the exact same content back(most JustinTv streamers,for ex,make minor changes to their url),or if they suggest,instruct or provide ways to get around DMCA,they can be prosecuted. So in reality it seems that Roku is better protected by the "Fair Use"act by not trying to police a channel on their own ,or they can be held liable.

IMHO
 
-LD
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Re: Channel developers

Thu Jun 30, 2011 8:20 am

Stick it to "the man!"

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