Your Digital Media Has Never Looked So Good

 
FX4
Posts: 2089
Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 9:52 am

Re: Old Roku

Thu Mar 22, 2012 4:04 pm

steamer wrote:
mikebdoss wrote:
FX4 wrote:
My daughter has the original and I am am constantly pushing her to upgrade. The difference is huge ranging from picture quality to number of channels. Get the S model. I agree with you about the lack of Ethernet ports. Too many headaches streaming with wireless.


What channels (besides the games made for the new remote) are available on new units, but not on the original box? And is the picture quality really that different? The original box does 720P, and the vast majority of content is served at that resolution.


~~~
right ... if you aren't 'gaming' you don't need the Roku2.
my original XDS does 1080p ...
and i don't intend to 'upgrade' [don't think it is]
unless forced to by lack of support for the old box.
probably come out with a Roku3 right after i did anyway. ;)

The XD|S is not worth upgrading from. I own one of those too. But we are not talking about an XD|S here which is not all that old. We are talking about a gen 1. XD|S is like gen 1.5. I really don't know why they didn't call those units Gen 2 and the current units gen 3.
OTA - Antennacraft HDX 1000
Roku 4 (x1)
Roku 3 (x3)
Roku Streaming Stick (x1)
Roku2 XS (x4)
Nvidia Shield
Raspberry Pi XBMC
MacMini XBMC/Plex
ATV3 (x2)
 
User avatar
kc8pql
** Valued Community Member **
Posts: 9040
Joined: Fri Jan 23, 2009 3:54 pm
Location: US

Re: Old Roku

Thu Mar 22, 2012 4:20 pm

FX4 wrote:
I really don't know why they didn't call those units Gen 2 and the current units gen 3.

It's the internal hardware. All R1's, including the original, have the same CPU and hardware design, code name Pica. R2 uses a new, second generation design and CPU, code name Giga.
____________________________________________________________________________________________________________
No, I don't work for Roku.
Netflix Player N1000X, XDS 2100X (premature death by lightning)
Roku2 XD 3050X, Roku2 XS 3100R, Roku2 4210R
 
User avatar
RokuShawnS
Roku Engineering
Posts: 6571
Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2011 2:21 pm

Re: Old Roku

Thu Mar 22, 2012 4:44 pm

kc8pql wrote:
FX4 wrote:
I really don't know why they didn't call those units Gen 2 and the current units gen 3.

It's the internal hardware. All R1's, including the original, have the same CPU and hardware design, code name Pica. R2 uses a new, second generation design and CPU, code name Giga.


Pico :) (which technically only refers to the later editions of the R1 units, although it's a good catch-all for all of them).

C. Shawn Smith
C. Shawn Smith
Community Liaison

------------
The Cosmos is all that is, and all that was, and ever will be. -- Carl Sagan
 
FX4
Posts: 2089
Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 9:52 am

Re: Old Roku

Thu Mar 22, 2012 5:07 pm

So Shawn what is the difference technical difference between early generation one and the later generation one units? Other than they look different on the outside the picture is clearly different. Do they have different processors, different graphics chip? I have all three generations and each generation has an observably better picture than the prior generation.
OTA - Antennacraft HDX 1000
Roku 4 (x1)
Roku 3 (x3)
Roku Streaming Stick (x1)
Roku2 XS (x4)
Nvidia Shield
Raspberry Pi XBMC
MacMini XBMC/Plex
ATV3 (x2)
 
User avatar
RokuShawnS
Roku Engineering
Posts: 6571
Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2011 2:21 pm

Re: Old Roku

Thu Mar 22, 2012 5:13 pm

I honestly know very little about the hardware aspects of each generation, only the basics that most of you know already.

C. Shawn Smith
C. Shawn Smith
Community Liaison

------------
The Cosmos is all that is, and all that was, and ever will be. -- Carl Sagan
 
mikebdoss
** Valued Community Member **
Posts: 4919
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2010 12:52 am

Re: Old Roku

Thu Mar 22, 2012 5:53 pm

FX4 wrote:
So Shawn what is the difference technical difference between early generation one and the later generation one units? Other than they look different on the outside the picture is clearly different. Do they have different processors, different graphics chip? I have all three generations and each generation has an observably better picture than the prior generation.


I honestly think you're just seeing what you want to see. I've never heard anyone say that before, in fact, I've only heard people say each generation has the same PQ. I don't have the original box, but I have an XDS and a new XS, and the picture is identical on my TV, from what I can tell.
 
FX4
Posts: 2089
Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 9:52 am

Re: Old Roku

Thu Mar 22, 2012 6:07 pm

No I have a trained eye. I looked at MPEG2 streams until my head hurt from 2001 to 2003 verifying picture quality. Each generation has a better picture. Really it's not even close from early generation one to generation two. The black levels are poor on the early gen one units and there is quite a large amount of digital artifacts. Late gen one the digital artifacts improve a lot, but I still see some here and there, the black levels are better. The Gen 2s the black levels are dead gorgeous and I see very few digital artifacts. On the early gen one units the high resolution picture looks like it has raster lines in picture. It almost looks like a really good NTSC signal. It's kind of puzzling. You don't see that on the late gen ones or the gen 2s.
OTA - Antennacraft HDX 1000
Roku 4 (x1)
Roku 3 (x3)
Roku Streaming Stick (x1)
Roku2 XS (x4)
Nvidia Shield
Raspberry Pi XBMC
MacMini XBMC/Plex
ATV3 (x2)
 
User avatar
gonzotek
** Valued Community Member **
Posts: 2210
Joined: Thu May 06, 2010 12:40 pm
Contact:

Re: Old Roku

Fri Mar 23, 2012 7:36 am

FX4 wrote:
No I have a trained eye. I looked at MPEG2 streams until my head hurt from 2001 to 2003 verifying picture quality. Each generation has a better picture. Really it's not even close from early generation one to generation two. The black levels are poor on the early gen one units and there is quite a large amount of digital artifacts. Late gen one the digital artifacts improve a lot, but I still see some here and there, the black levels are better. The Gen 2s the black levels are dead gorgeous and I see very few digital artifacts. On the early gen one units the high resolution picture looks like it has raster lines in picture. It almost looks like a really good NTSC signal. It's kind of puzzling. You don't see that on the late gen ones or the gen 2s.
Testing methodology? Are or were the two Gen1 units being compared attached to equivalent equipment using the same connection type, receiving equivalent signal/bandwidth, in the same geographical location at the same time, receiving the same content, using the same firmware? All of these could have an effect on the picture quality. Your results can be independently verified by others if you document the steps you took to reach them; without independent verification(s) we have no definite way of knowing if there were not other factors (outside of the internal hardware) affecting your results. Not saying you are wrong, just that I'd like to get more data to back up the claim before I can confidently repeat it as a fact to others.

The black level in Gen2 units is a point of contention among some users: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=47787
Remoku.tv - A free web app for Roku Remote Control!
Want to control your Roku from nearly any phone, computer or tablet? Get started at http://help.remoku.tv
by Apps4TV - Applications for television and beyond: http://www.apps4tv.com
 
FX4
Posts: 2089
Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 9:52 am

Re: Old Roku

Fri Mar 23, 2012 7:46 am

Yeah I just have high end video test equipment laying around the house. BTW commercial industry uses test equipment to set up the system and make certain everything is in calibration but the final test is lots of eyeball time. It's the majority of testing. When you spot something you go back and look at your test equipment and signal analyzers to see if they are telling you anything, most of the time they don't. It's just a lot of hard work isolating what is causing the unacceptable condition. In commercial industry you go back to the equipment manufacturer. In home video you get, what you get unless you are a top one percent enthusiast, the manufactures will work with you to resolve quality issues. At the 100.00 mark, it is what it is.
Last edited by FX4 on Fri Mar 23, 2012 10:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
OTA - Antennacraft HDX 1000
Roku 4 (x1)
Roku 3 (x3)
Roku Streaming Stick (x1)
Roku2 XS (x4)
Nvidia Shield
Raspberry Pi XBMC
MacMini XBMC/Plex
ATV3 (x2)
 
FX4
Posts: 2089
Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 9:52 am

Re: Old Roku

Fri Mar 23, 2012 8:07 am

gonzotek wrote:
FX4 wrote:
No I have a trained eye. I looked at MPEG2 streams until my head hurt from 2001 to 2003 verifying picture quality. Each generation has a better picture. Really it's not even close from early generation one to generation two. The black levels are poor on the early gen one units and there is quite a large amount of digital artifacts. Late gen one the digital artifacts improve a lot, but I still see some here and there, the black levels are better. The Gen 2s the black levels are dead gorgeous and I see very few digital artifacts. On the early gen one units the high resolution picture looks like it has raster lines in picture. It almost looks like a really good NTSC signal. It's kind of puzzling. You don't see that on the late gen ones or the gen 2s.
Testing methodology? Are or were the two Gen1 units being compared attached to equivalent equipment using the same connection type, receiving equivalent signal/bandwidth, in the same geographical location at the same time, receiving the same content, using the same firmware? All of these could have an effect on the picture quality. Your results can be independently verified by others if you document the steps you took to reach them; without independent verification(s) we have no definite way of knowing if there were not other factors (outside of the internal hardware) affecting your results. Not saying you are wrong, just that I'd like to get more data to back up the claim before I can confidently repeat it as a fact to others.

The black level in Gen2 units is a point of contention among some users: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=47787

I'm using a Samsung PN63C8000YF which is about as good as it gets for home television. I'll have to read that entire thread. It looks like that discussion evolves around unbound full range RGB which is a different discussion. And I suppose you can make an argument that is a decrease in quality but not what I am looking for in the box. If I want a truly high definition picture I'm not heading to Roku for that. I start firing up home theater gear, when I want the true 1080P experience. What I don't like seeing which is what I am discussing here is picture defect issues. Blacks that look more grey than black, little digital blocks in the back ground (artifacts), and other defects like that raster line thing (I don't know what else to call it, because I don't know what the cause is). I think that discussion before fully reading evolves around true high definition issues, rather than picture defects.
OTA - Antennacraft HDX 1000
Roku 4 (x1)
Roku 3 (x3)
Roku Streaming Stick (x1)
Roku2 XS (x4)
Nvidia Shield
Raspberry Pi XBMC
MacMini XBMC/Plex
ATV3 (x2)
 
FX4
Posts: 2089
Joined: Wed Oct 20, 2010 9:52 am

Re: Old Roku

Fri Mar 23, 2012 8:28 am

Okay you referenced a thread that references a thread. I don't see that issue at all. My blacks are dead black, impressively black on my Roku 2S. Not so much so on my Roku XD|S, it's not bad it's just not WOW that is black. MY XR the black levels kind of annoyed me which is in part why it got moved to the vacation home.
OTA - Antennacraft HDX 1000
Roku 4 (x1)
Roku 3 (x3)
Roku Streaming Stick (x1)
Roku2 XS (x4)
Nvidia Shield
Raspberry Pi XBMC
MacMini XBMC/Plex
ATV3 (x2)

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: leehrat and 14 guests